"Brands need to own the narrative and facts again"

m&k: Roger Hämmerli, it's been five years since we conducted our first interview in your first office on wooden pallets.

Roger Hämmerli: Ah, the good old wooden pallets. Honestly. I can't even remember what I did before Andy. Either that's a good sign - or a very bad one and I'm getting old (laughs). An incredible amount has happened in that time and sometimes you think to yourself "What? Only 5 years" and at other times you already feel like an old hand in the market environment. I would be lying if I said it was an easy time. From a few months before Covid-19 to the Ukraine war to Donald J. Trump's second term in office, we've been through it all - I dare say there are easier market situations.

You simply have to go in with the firm conviction that you have the better idea.

But doesn't it speak for you that it worked out anyway? With clients such as UBS, Axpo or Fisherman's Friend, you could be accused of "complaining at a high level".

The great mandates that we were able to win in 2024 in particular, with Axpo and UBS as social leads, naturally stand out in the portfolio. Or Fisherman's Friend, which we have been supporting for years - almost since it was founded - but you only see the result (smiles). It took a lot of work in the background. Hours and hours of discarding ideas - as well as investments made in the hope that it would work. We always had to sail close to the wind. As an independent young agency, you don't have any advance praise or budget reserves like the established players you're competing against. You simply have to go in with the firm conviction that you have the better idea for the problem. But in summary, you're right: if you had asked me five years ago whether I would sign up to today's starting position, I wouldn't have hesitated and picked up the pen. But now we're ready for the next chapter.

The next chapter?

Young agencies and their founders - including me - still believe that they do things a little differently and better. That's part of the charm of the new. From a certain size and position in the market, however, you also have to follow the rules and standards so that you can take part in larger tenders and more complex mandate structures. And we worked on this in 2024. With a new brand identity, new structures and new disciplines in our teams, we are taking the step to the big table.

In concrete terms?

Andy will be bolder in 2025 and approach the market landscape with a clear edge. Our new look is a first step - and there are a few more projects to come that we'll soon be able to talk to you about.

You get the feeling that things are still moving forward with Andy. Do you never settle down?

To be honest, we've been quiet for too long. That annoys me. That's why we're talking now (laughs). But it was self-inflicted. We invested a huge amount of time in the new "Andy consciousness" in 2024. Winning major mandates has forced us to grow up. And that takes a lot of energy, time and patience within the company.

I am still driven by the idea that there are ever more innovative approaches to telling stories digitally - and we must not and cannot stand still. The era of AI agents and the like is upon us. Now is the time - even if it hurts - to challenge structures, processes and old ways of thinking. Even for an agency that has only been on the market for five years. I am firmly convinced that 2025 could be a groundbreaking year for us agencies.

Social platforms are holding a mirror up to our faces right now - and it paints a pretty dirty picture.

What's in store for us in 2025 - especially with regard to social media?

2025 and beyond will certainly be challenging in many respects. However, I am confident that we will tackle this as an industry and as a society. As a communications service provider, it is in our hands to develop suitable solutions together with our partners.

Which topic stands out for you here?

I am currently seeing a lot of movement and a shift in behavior in the ecosphere of social media platforms. From X to Meta and TikTok, conversations, content and community feedback are changing. The Silicon Valley tech bros and the new US government have a lot of plans right now, but regulation is certainly not one of them. Mark Zuckerberg and Elon Musk are hinting at what society will have to prepare for in the coming years: Untruths, stupidity, bullying, propaganda bots and the pure unfiltered internet. Social platforms are holding a mirror up to our faces right now - and it's a pretty dirty picture.

What do you mean by your last statement - the mirror in front of society's face? Are we ourselves to blame for our misery?

To put it pragmatically: yes, we are. No platform forces you to write jokes or derogatory comments about an influencer's appearance on someone else's profile or to harass a person with hundreds of comments because they made a mistake in public. But the internet has never shown us any real consequences for this behavior - except in a few extreme cases that have been prosecuted. With fact-checking, moderation teams, machine learning, education and much more, social platforms have always tried to take action against hate speech, pornographic content, violence and the like. With moderate success - and this success is now being put on hold in some parts of the world as Meta and other platforms dismantle fact-checkers, initiatives and moderation teams.

Social media is now becoming a real digital regulars' table - with all the participants you only know from awkward family gatherings.

What will be the result of this?

That we can follow the unfiltered social thought process on social media. But with one crucial difference to real life: There is no barrier or hurdle to making one's views known. I would argue that we've all had our thoughts on something and then thought it best not to share them with the person in the same room, right? Well, yes. Social media is now becoming a real digital regulars' table - with all the participants you only really know from awkward family gatherings. And the opinions that leave you gritting your teeth with nerves of steel.

So the whole thing is pretty gloomy?

Not at all. I simply don't believe that you can spend your time with platitudes and kumbaya chants at a time like this. After all, fact-deniers, flat-earthers and Elon Musk disciples don't do that either. You have to call a spade a spade. And I am convinced that we as a society, but especially our industry, now have the opportunity to shape this new social landscape. And brands will play a decisive role in this. Brands need to own the narrative and the facts again and not just let it happen. At a time when trust in politics and traditional media is on shaky ground, companies can step into the gap and convince with clear values and arguments. It has never been more important than now.

Is there a hint of optimism here?

I would describe myself as a pragmatic optimist. I couldn't be an entrepreneur any other way. Imagine I was a pessimist. Then founding an agency at that time would have been my personal downfall (laughs). But to come back to your question: Yes, there is optimism there. Because I know from social behavior that an overwhelming proportion of users are silent readers and don't actively contribute to the discourse or share content. These people need to be picked up. Not the very loud, sometimes extreme minority. There is no point in discussing or "fighting" with fact-deniers in comment columns. It is important to score points with well-prepared information, exciting and well-told stories. And we agencies, together with our brand partners, can do that better than anyone else, can't we? We now have a duty to sustainably improve media consumption and the behavior of the next generation on social media. So that politics, the fourth estate and ultimately our society once again have the communication landscape we deserve.

Was that your final word?

My final word? 2025 will be tough, but what year in the recent past hasn't been? Now is the time to move forward with courage and character - also and above all as a brand. Andy and I are looking forward to the challenge and I'm sure that this year still has a lot up its sleeve for us. A little note in advance: we already have something in the works when it comes to leading the way with courage and character. More on that soon. As always, it was a pleasure chatting with you. Thanks for coming by - even if it's no longer the somewhat uncomfortable but charming Euro pallets (smiles).

Andy Was Right is an independent content agency that unites all disciplines relating to digital stories under one roof. The agency lives and loves pop culture and trends, and content is the main thing, not a side issue. While others manage stakeholders, Andy prefers to manage communities and reach them with content that really moves them.